Comments - Anatomy Of American Ignorance - 12160 Social Network2024-03-28T17:19:01Zhttps://12160.info/profiles/comment/feed?attachedTo=2649739%3ABlogPost%3A93447&xn_auth=noA good post Jeff, and call me…tag:12160.info,2009-08-28:2649739:Comment:951222009-08-28T16:47:49.006ZFred Blackhttps://12160.info/profile/FredBlack
A good post Jeff, and call me sadistic, but I kind of also enjoyed the volley of insults that ensued, very entertaining.<br />
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I don't think anyone need get defensive over the charge of being a stupid, ignorant race. Sure it’s true, but we are all in the same boat. As I was reading I felt as though this truth applied equally to my own nation, we after all complied with, aided and abetted the US 100% in the massacre of a million innocent people while destroying the ancient cultural assets of that…
A good post Jeff, and call me sadistic, but I kind of also enjoyed the volley of insults that ensued, very entertaining.<br />
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I don't think anyone need get defensive over the charge of being a stupid, ignorant race. Sure it’s true, but we are all in the same boat. As I was reading I felt as though this truth applied equally to my own nation, we after all complied with, aided and abetted the US 100% in the massacre of a million innocent people while destroying the ancient cultural assets of that invaded land. The conditioning of ignorance is global. Only by accepting we gave our consent to those crimes, can we hope to evolve beyond stupidity.<br />
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I don’t agree that things are getting worse because of the Joker; things are just getting worse with the Joker because that is the plan in motion, the same plan that has always been. Your current Prez hasn’t conducted major business with the Saudis, he doesn’t have a father that headed the CIA committing acts of genocide across South America, and didn’t have a grandfather who managed banking for Hitler.<br />
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I think Doug might have a point, it’s the walls of words that have enabled the insane elite to justify their actions, and what is worse, condition the general population to accept those actions and, those same walls divide us here when supposedly, we know better. Karen....He's talking about -…tag:12160.info,2009-08-28:2649739:Comment:951062009-08-28T13:46:02.887ZDoug Wilsonhttps://12160.info/profile/wilson
Karen....He's talking about - at least - hydrogen
Karen....He's talking about - at least - hydrogen Dino -topia?
U-topia: an ide…tag:12160.info,2009-08-28:2649739:Comment:951052009-08-28T13:43:53.674ZDoug Wilsonhttps://12160.info/profile/wilson
Dino -topia?<br />
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U-topia: an ideal community or society, taken from Of the Best State of a Republic, and of the New Island Utopia, a book written in 1516 by Sir Thomas More describing a fictional island in the Atlantic Ocean, possessing a seemingly perfect socio-politico-legal system.<br />
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So, Dino-topia?<br />
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Lets see, Dinosaur: The term "dinosaur" was coined in 1842 by Sir Richard Owen and derives from Greek δεινός (deinos) "terrible, powerful, wondrous" + σαῦρος (sauros) "lizard".<br />
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Dino: terrible,…
Dino -topia?<br />
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U-topia: an ideal community or society, taken from Of the Best State of a Republic, and of the New Island Utopia, a book written in 1516 by Sir Thomas More describing a fictional island in the Atlantic Ocean, possessing a seemingly perfect socio-politico-legal system.<br />
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So, Dino-topia?<br />
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Lets see, Dinosaur: The term "dinosaur" was coined in 1842 by Sir Richard Owen and derives from Greek δεινός (deinos) "terrible, powerful, wondrous" + σαῦρος (sauros) "lizard".<br />
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Dino: terrible, powerful, wondrous....<br />
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Topia: community or society....<br />
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I guess they think you're a either a Terrible Community or Society, Wonderous Community or Society, Powerful Community or Society....<br />
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I guess this leaves some room for interpretation. I don't see how you can be a society (by your self) but I'm not at all sure about that, After all there were no words until we started making them up. Maybe by next year you can be a society - it could happen. I don't see you as terrible, or wondrous, so that leaves powerful. So I guess for now until someone does something to make it possible for you, on your own, to be a society, you'll have to just go with powerful. On the other hand corporations were given the status of people so we really shouldn't count anything out.<br />
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My first that this morning, that I found interesting, was that we all build walls - with words. I read the words "Great Nation" in one of the comments. That's a really good wall, it defines a position which says, "I am great, you are something else...". I am here, you are there - Wall. Build me a health care system so I can get inside of it - walled in, enclosed within. System of Democracy, Collectivism, Fascism - We are here inside, you are out there, outside. I guess the original wall was "this is mine". My stuff is here, separated from your stuff by this imaginary, agreed upon wall we'll build with words.<br />
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People are ignorant, stupid vs. Brilliant, wise - Separate us from them, define.... - Walls, barriers, boundaries.<br />
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I decided to not go inside this contraptions. I have to say my name is Doug Wilson so that I can talk with you. If you ask me where I live I'll say North of Fort Worth, TX. but I never really live there. It's my global position at the moment. If asked I say I'm a US Citizen, but I don't really think of myself that way. I don't belong to, or adhere to, or allow myself to be enclosed, entrapped or conditioned by any "Word Walls". I don't choose to live in there, to me, they are pens. I don't want to let myself be placed in a pen. I don't exist within any "Idea Boundaries". As long as I don't go inside - I'm free. Arguing is a type of mental energy snare, which could be seen as a pen...but that's a whole other story. So essentially Marklar it isn…tag:12160.info,2009-08-25:2649739:Comment:943092009-08-25T12:11:29.143ZJeffhttps://12160.info/profile/Jeff
So essentially Marklar it isn't a doom or gloom perspective.<br />
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Paul Kingsnorth recently posted an email he wrote to George Monbiot. They're both well known writers and I suppose Kingsnorth says it best and makes my position easy to understand.<br />
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Dear George,<br />
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On the desk in front of me is a set of graphs. The horizontal axis of each represents the years 1750 to 2000. The graphs show, variously, population levels, CO2 concentration in the atmosphere, exploitation of fisheries, destruction of…
So essentially Marklar it isn't a doom or gloom perspective.<br />
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Paul Kingsnorth recently posted an email he wrote to George Monbiot. They're both well known writers and I suppose Kingsnorth says it best and makes my position easy to understand.<br />
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Dear George,<br />
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On the desk in front of me is a set of graphs. The horizontal axis of each represents the years 1750 to 2000. The graphs show, variously, population levels, CO2 concentration in the atmosphere, exploitation of fisheries, destruction of tropical forests, paper consumption, number of motor vehicles, water use, the rate of species extinction and the totality of the human economy’s gross domestic product.<br />
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What grips me about these graphs (and graphs don’t usually grip me) is that though they all show very different things, they have an almost identical shape. A line begins on the left of the page, rising gradually as it moves to the right. Then, in the last inch or so, around 1950, it veers steeply upwards, like a pilot banking after a cliff has suddenly appeared from what he thought was an empty bank of cloud.<br />
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The root cause of all these trends is the same: a rapacious human economy bringing the world swiftly to the brink of chaos. We know this; some of us even attempt to stop it happening. Yet all of these trends continue to get rapidly worse, and there is no sign of that changing soon. What these graphs make clear better than anything else is the cold reality: there is a serious crash on the way.<br />
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Yet very few of us are prepared to look honestly at the message this reality is screaming at us: that the civilization we are a part of is hitting the buffers at full speed, and it is too late to stop it. Instead, most of us, and I include in this generalization much of the mainstream environmental movement, are still wedded to a vision of the future as an upgraded version of the present. We still believe in “progress”, as lazily defined by western liberalism. We still believe that we will be able to continue living more or less the same comfortable lives (albeit with more windfarms and better lightbulbs) if we can only embrace “sustainable development” rapidly enough; and that we can then extend it to the extra 3 billion people who will shortly join us on this already gasping planet.<br />
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I think this is simply denial. The writing is on the wall for industrial society, and no amount of ethical shopping or determined protesting is going to change that now. <i>Take a civilization built on the myth of human exceptionalism and a deeply embedded cultural attitude to “nature”; add a blind belief in technological and material progress; then fuel the whole thing with a power source that is discovered to be disastrously destructive only after we have used it to inflate our numbers and appetites beyond the point of no return. What do you get? We are starting to find out.</i><br />
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We need to get real. Climate change is teetering on the point of no return while our leaders bang the drum for more growth. The economic system we rely upon cannot be tamed without collapsing, for it relies upon that growth to function. And who wants it tamed anyway? Most people in the rich world won’t be giving up their cars or holidays without a fight.<br />
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Some people—perhaps you—believe that these things should not be said, even if true, because saying them will deprive people of “hope”, and without hope there will be no chance of “saving the planet”. But false hope is worse than no hope at all. As for saving the planet, what we are really trying to save, as we scrabble around planting turbines on mountains and shouting at ministers, is not the planet but our attachment to the western material culture, which we cannot imagine living without.<br />
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The challenge is not how to shore up a crumbling empire with wave machines and global summits, but to start thinking about how we are going to live through its fall, and what we can learn from its collapse.<br />
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Paul<br />
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Marklar, I am of the opinion that there is, as of today, right now, no replacement for oil. Even if, as you say, water and thus hydrogen replace oil at some point in the near future you must recognize that you're asserting that an entire infrastructure based on gasoline powered machinery, automobiles, trains, ships and planes as well as energy supply (coal fired and nuclear power plants) can be retooled and even that endeavor seems unlikely to me.<br />
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I think we're seeing the global elite scrambling for the remaining resources, copper, uranium, aluminum, nickel, and of course petroleum and others, while at the same time they've been circling the wagons for the expected change in western lifestyle.<br />
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We see the FEMA camps as ominous when in reality they are more likely for the expected mass migration northward of Mexican immigrants in the years ahead resulting from the economic failure of Mexico, we see the basis for Martial Law established not to quell legitimate dissent but to control masses of sick, starving, unemployed and homeless people, we see the invasion of foreign countries not to foment democracy but to shore up and maintain control over the very last resources the planet has to offer.<br />
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Honestly, I wish I were going to be alive for the next 100 years if only to see what actually happens because I'm terribly curious but at almost 60 it's unlikely that I'll be here that much longer. My grandkids will be here. Yes, the potential energy in…tag:12160.info,2009-08-25:2649739:Comment:943082009-08-25T11:46:18.385ZJeffhttps://12160.info/profile/Jeff
Yes, the potential energy in water may be enormous, if we can manage to extract that energy sufficiently.<br />
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Interesting that you're an engineer in this particular field Marklar. While we may disagree on the final analysis of the energy conundrum, and all of the information surrounding the outcome is surely mere speculation at this point, the curve in human advancement and evolution may be about to take a downward slide for the first time in recorded history.<br />
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While you may believe otherwise I…
Yes, the potential energy in water may be enormous, if we can manage to extract that energy sufficiently.<br />
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Interesting that you're an engineer in this particular field Marklar. While we may disagree on the final analysis of the energy conundrum, and all of the information surrounding the outcome is surely mere speculation at this point, the curve in human advancement and evolution may be about to take a downward slide for the first time in recorded history.<br />
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While you may believe otherwise I see something similar to a population hitting a wall. Between climate change, war, resource acquisition, species depletion and the evolution of disease there appears that a perfect storm might very well be on the horizon. While no one knows for sure of course it certainly warrants close attention and a clear understanding of the facts surrounding the potential for catastrophe.<br />
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Karen's question regarding your seriousness, or your being a nitwit, provides a clear example of her inability to understand the material at hand and its implications for the future of humanity. While no one is about to drop off the face of the earth for lack of energy the insidious nature of the progression of the loss of energy humanity is going to experience and face means it should be watched carefully.<br />
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The potential for the Stone Age to once again follow the Oil Age exists, regardless of religion, nationality, race, creed or color.<br />
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That's my premise and truthfully, no one knows because no one can predict the future, but from my own perspective the evidence is overwhelming that there simply is no replacement for petroleum.<br />
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Karen, maintaining a position of open dialogue with intelligent people is always a wise proposition. Prove me wrong.tag:12160.info,2009-08-25:2649739:Comment:942642009-08-25T05:09:55.525ZMarklarhttps://12160.info/profile/Marklar
Prove me wrong.
Prove me wrong. Marklar..Are you being seriou…tag:12160.info,2009-08-25:2649739:Comment:942392009-08-25T04:34:10.271ZMimsgirlhttps://12160.info/profile/KarenHatcher
Marklar..Are you being serious......... or are you just being a nit-wit on purpose?
Marklar..Are you being serious......... or are you just being a nit-wit on purpose? ,... and of course water cont…tag:12160.info,2009-08-25:2649739:Comment:942132009-08-25T03:50:04.739ZMarklarhttps://12160.info/profile/Marklar
,... and of course water contains many times the amount of potential energy that a like amount of oil or gasoline does.
,... and of course water contains many times the amount of potential energy that a like amount of oil or gasoline does. Jeff, I've gone through the m…tag:12160.info,2009-08-25:2649739:Comment:942102009-08-25T03:46:45.270ZMarklarhttps://12160.info/profile/Marklar
Jeff, I've gone through the material and all of this presumes the inability of mankind to shift away from fossil fuels. I don't believe this is true for a moment. Sure there will be some economic upheavel as things change but there will also be opportunities - hadn't you heard that necessity is the mother of invention?<br />
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This guy may be the kingpin know it all when it comes to statistics and world oil consumption but he is not sitting at the forefront of alternative energy I presume. Wind mills,…
Jeff, I've gone through the material and all of this presumes the inability of mankind to shift away from fossil fuels. I don't believe this is true for a moment. Sure there will be some economic upheavel as things change but there will also be opportunities - hadn't you heard that necessity is the mother of invention?<br />
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This guy may be the kingpin know it all when it comes to statistics and world oil consumption but he is not sitting at the forefront of alternative energy I presume. Wind mills, solar, and nuclear energy are all old tech with a dubious future.<br />
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Hydrogen seems to be the immediate fuel of the future that will replace oil. To date the biggest problem with practical hydrogen power is that hydrogen must be shipped from place to place just like oil except that until now this could not be done in practical quantities except by cooling the hydrogen until it takes the form of liquid hydrogen. This of course requires a lot of equipment which further reduces the amount of fuel that can be shipped in a tanker truck.<br />
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A team of chemists here in Seattle has discovered an efficient process for binding hydrogen atoms to an organic molecule creating a room temperature liquid that can be shipped in a standard tanker truck with no special modifications, Even now the infrastructure for hydrogen production and distribution is being created here on the West coast. The head of the board of directors for this company is a former employer of mine who is credited as being one of the primary figures in the evolution of the Seattle tech corridor and he doesn't make a habit of involving himself in technologies or investment opportunities destined to fail.<br />
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Currently I am the chief engineer for a small alternative energy company poised to put even that achievement to shame. Our patents are currently pending but at this juncture I am very closed mouthed about exactly what we are doing as you might understand. I feel assured in saying though that we can double the gas mileage of automobiles with a similar increase of efficiency in any other device involving combustion whether it be a your water heater or a coal fired power plant. In the long term we can aid greatly in switching to a fully hydrogen based economy with other alternative energy sources such as solar and wind power doing their small part as well with nuclear energy hopefully cut out of the equation for good.<br />
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This will require large amounts of water of course but the biggest challenges to large desalinization plants has always been an unwillingness for anyone to host them thereby screwing up the view from their ocean from property. When the reduction of oil supplies becomes severe enough that barrier will crumble.<br />
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So peak oil certainly presents challenges but I really don't see it being the end of the world. While the down side of that bell curve may be steeper than the up side the taps aren't exactly going to all shut off at once tomorrow either,<br />
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Living in relative freedom and dignity without someone looking over your shoulder every minute of the day and micromanaging your life is really a vastly larger and more complex challenge to deal with. Karen, I haven't had a meltdo…tag:12160.info,2009-08-25:2649739:Comment:941702009-08-25T00:23:15.749ZJeffhttps://12160.info/profile/Jeff
Karen, I haven't had a meltdown dear, I simply have information that you haven't yet factored into your opinions. One day you'll awaken to the reality of the future, the very near future.
Karen, I haven't had a meltdown dear, I simply have information that you haven't yet factored into your opinions. One day you'll awaken to the reality of the future, the very near future.