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Comment by Parrhesia on December 14, 2022 at 2:59pm

"Japan started the war" - Japan's attack on Pearl Harbor was instigated by the US government.  In the four years leading up to Pearl Harbor, the US implemented ever more restrictive trade measures on Japan, including embargoes on much-needed oil, gasoline, and scrap metal, and froze Japanese assets.  The U.S. sent an ultimatum to Japan sent in late November 1941 which included demands that Japan withdraw all forces from China and Indochina.  It was considered by Japan to be a “declaration of war.”  The White/Hull ultimatum was a deliberate catch-22. If the Japanese refused it, the embargo would continue, and they would collapse from economic strangulation. If they complied, and withdrew all troops from the mainland, communism would sweep Eastern Asia.  The Japanese were thus given a two-headed coin: die by starvation or die by communism. They decided to reject both options and fight instead.  Pearl Harbor was the excuse the US used to join WW2.

The USSR was invaded by Germany (codename Operation “Barbarossa) on June 22, 1941.  The Soviets fought 10 of the most important battles of WW2 among many more and greatly weakened Germany thus making the battles on the Western Front easier for the Allies to win.  Battle of Stalingrad, Dnieper-Carpathian, Battle of Moscow, Operation Bagration, Battle of Kursk, Battle of Kiev, Battle of Berlin, Battle of Smolensk, Battle of Narva and 2nd Battle of Kharkov.  How dare you minimize their contributions.  The actions of the Soviet Union under communist control at that time and the Russia of today is not the same.  To whine about things the USSR did (because they were "bad") when we bombed civilians in Hiroshima and Nagasaki; joined the UK in the fire-bombing of civilians in Dresden and talk about how great Churchill was while he ordered "terror bombings" on civilian cities like Berlin is hypocritical.

It wasn't "some Admiral"; It was Admiral William Leahy – the highest-ranking member of the U.S. military from 1942 until retiring in 1949, who was the first de facto Chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff, and who was at the center of all major American military decisions in World War II, but I'm sure he didn't have access the info that the people you talked to had.  As far as "out of context", he wrote a book about it.

The Marshall Plan basically kept people in Europe from starving and required trade with the US which gave the US power.  It also helped to bring Europe under one umbrella, so the EU could be formed.

A Hollywood propaganda program is to form the public's opinion to what the government wants the citizens to believe.  Apparently, you think the government knows best.  Forget reality as long as you "feel good".

Things in this world are not 'all good' or 'all evil'.  I'm not making judgments; I am pointing out facts concerning actions of the American Government.  If you believe criticizing actions of the US government make me anti-American, then don't you dare criticize anything the Biden Administration does, or you are also "Anti-American".

What happened after WW2:  UN, 5 Eyes, NATO, CIA, WEF, WHO, Tri-lateral Commission, The Club of Rome, larger government, fewer illusions of freedom, LGBTQ+, Trans-Ideology of children, CRT, coup of the government and installation of a senile idiot as Resident, lockdowns, mandatory participation in a clinical trial, censorship, drag queen story hours...Good thing the Nazis didn't win or we wouldn't be sinking into communism.

BTW, Russia paid back the USSR's debt of the Lend-Lease in August of 2006.

Comment by Doc Vega on December 14, 2022 at 12:16pm

Parrhesia,

It seems to me you are consistently anti-American so much as even being a leftist propagandist. For one thing you claim that the unfortunate deaths of 200 thousand Japanese civilians at Hiroshima and Nagasaki is not justified but it's okay that 1 million Allied casualties would be acceptable when Japan started the war and since the turn of the 20th Century had long range plans to militarily annex much of the Pacific theater when it was the US merging with Japan diplomatically and through trade that allowed the Japanese to enter the western world and profit from it? I'm sorry Pal that's an awful weak rationale.

Don't pain the Soviet Union as being admirable in any way shape or form as during the 2nd World War they simply fight to regain their own territory, refused any aid to Poland, took possession of several Hungary, Czechoslovakia, Bulgaria, Yugoslavia, and others who became satellite nations that they subjugated with an iron fist and then you wonder why none of them wants to be back under Russian rule again? In the 1920's America and Europe sent engineers and technology to the Russians because they reached out to the west needing to create infrastructure so we gave them hydro-electric technology so they could modernize their backward country. The what happened in thanks for doing that the Communists slammed to door shut to the west again! 

While the US gave Russian billions of dollars of armament and supplies through the Lend Lease Act none was ever repaid. Had the US not leant P-40's P-39 Cobra's Sherman tanks and more to the Russians they may have had to capitulate. DO YOU RECALL that prior to Operation "Barbarosa" Russia had a non-aggression pact with Hitler and the Nazis. They couldn't have given a shot about what happened to Europe! 

The White Sea Baltic Canal or known as the infamous One Mile Canal a forced labor camp project that took 10 years and the lives of 60,000 laborers to complete when a western contractors could have completed the projects in much lass time and without killing thousands of laborers just to prove to the west that Communists could get the job done? What an idiotic piece of governmental planning, but this does characterize many botched USSR plans.

The Marshall plan was to bring Europe back to an economic position to recover and jumpstart the world's global markets once more and not one dollar was ever paid back either! Only Great Britain paid back their debt. 

I don't care what admiral taken out of context said the Japs were beaten and the Atom bomb was not necessary. I've spoken with many WWII veterans and intelligence officers from that era and the Japs were not willing to surrender until after the bombs had been dropped they were more worried about saving face and going through back channels with the Swiss to negotiate an unconditional surrender and if the US was so fucking evil how is we rebuilt their industry and society? Even by the time the Korean War broke out many Japs were still bitter over losing the war. My Dad was there and witnessed it! 

I've got plenty of family who fought in the war and even lived in Europe and saw what happened during and after the war. And if the fucking Russians were such good guys why did Stalin built a wall the keep supplies from reaching starving peasants and Eastern Bloc citizens whose lives could have been saved by US air drops and DC-3 deliveries? Because it was all about Communist propaganda not about the welfare of his people! FACE IT, Russian government has used its people like worthless animals to bargain with and to keep under the thumb of the proletariat! 

And Hollywood was part of some WWII PR program? Yeah, it's called maintaining the morale of the citizenship during the most massive war known to man. And unlike today's chickenshit actors many well known leading men like Robert Taylor, Clark Gable, Jimmy Stewart, and Eddie Albert among many others went into harm's way to defend their country.

You don't create an alternative reality by looking into the past taking the emotion and stress of the time out of that point in history and start making judgments simply to support you anti-American conspiracy theory agenda.

 

Comment by Parrhesia on December 13, 2022 at 6:59pm

The US Public Indoctrination System teaches that America won the World War II and, with "American Exceptionalism", saved the world.  So, you are saying they can be trusted to tell the truth.  Or maybe it's Hollywood that can be trusted as they produced movies showing America saving the day.  They wouldn't use propaganda.  Truth is most of the fighting was in Eastern Europe and the main burden of defeating Hitler’s war machine was borne by the Soviet Union.  As far as Europe’s post-World War II success, Europeans deserve at least as much credit, if not more, as the US for rebuilding their economies and countries.  The Marshall Plan and US intervention was to bring western Europe under US influence and solidified The Cold War.  The US "helped" to strengthen its position.

Numerous people in positions to know have stated there was no need to kill 200,000 innocent civilians and dropping the bombs did not "save lives".  The Real Reason America Used Nuclear Weapons Against Japan. It Was ...  

Admiral William Leahy – the highest-ranking member of the U.S. military from 1942 until retiring in 1949, who was the first de facto Chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff, and who was at the center of all major American military decisions in World War II – wrote (pg. 441):

It is my opinion that the use of this barbarous weapon at Hiroshima and Nagasaki was of no material assistance in our war against Japan. The Japanese were already defeated and ready to surrender because of the effective sea blockade and the successful bombing with conventional weapons.

It's no wonder the USSR was paranoid of the US having the bomb.  The Soviets were our allies and couldn't trust us for good reason. Like narcissistic psychopaths, the US intrudes into other countries around the world because only the US knows what is best.  It's all justified.  After all the US has "the biggest stick".  How many lives would have been saved if the US had a smaller stick?  Here's some "false accusations" of US Imperialism.

How did dropping the bombs on non-military targets keep Japan with "millions of troops still alive and willing to fight to the death in many parts of the Pacific theater" from continuing the fight?  "Neither Hiroshima nor Nagasaki was deemed militarily vital by U.S. planners. (This is one of the reasons neither had been heavily bombed up to this point in the war.) Moreover, targeting [at Hiroshima and Nagasaki] was aimed explicitly on non-military facilities surrounded by workers’ homes."  General George Marshall (Chief of Staff of the US Army under FDR and Truman).  The US only killed innocents, including women and children.  A war crime, but okay since the US was on the winning side.

Also, you are presuming a lot saying the Nazis would have attacked the US.  The truth is that nobody can say what would have happened if they won.

You are the one revising history.

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